Bonnie Indeck, Supportive Care for Cancer
Patients
March 6, 2011
Welcome to Yale Cancer Center Answers with doctors Francine Foss and Lynn Wilson. I am Bruce Barber. Dr. Foss is a Professor of Medical Oncology and Dermatology, specializing in the treatment of lymphomas. Dr. Wilson is a Professor of Therapeutic Radiology and an expert in the use of radiation to treat lung cancers and cutaneous lymphomas. If you would like to join the conversation, you can contact the doctors directly. The address is canceranswers@yale.edu and the phone number is 1-888-234-4YCC. This evening, Lynn welcomes Bonnie Indeck. Bonnie is Director of Patient and Family Services at Yale Cancer Center and she is here to talk about support for cancer patients. Here is Lynn Wilson.
Wilson
Let's get started by having you tell us a little bit about what
support services are and why they are important for both patients
and caregivers?
Indeck
Support services are really a network of services that are
available to patients and families to help make their life during
cancer treatment a little bit easier. Often they can be of a
concrete nature, including help with transportation or finances,
but more often people use support services for the emotional pieces
of being treated for cancer. We do support groups to help
people, individual counseling. At Smilow Cancer Hospital, we
actually have a fairly new boutique that sells items that are
particularly helpful for cancer treatment including wigs and scarfs
and items if you have had a mastectomy. We tried to put all
the pieces together because we do know that medical treatment is
clearly why people are there, that's number 1, but you cannot get
through medical treatment unless you have the emotional component
and assistance with the emotional needs to help complete the
package for you.
Wilson
You and I have worked together for a long time, what sort of
changes have you seen since you have been at Yale? What things in
support services have advanced and changed, and what have you
appreciated over the time here?
Indeck
We have increased the number of services available to patients and
families and that's really a wonderful thing because we have so
many people with cancer that are being treated that we need to be
able to meet their needs. In fact, one of the things Smilow has
available is a patient and family advisory council, and we have
patients and families who actually make up the council along with a
few staff people, but it is the patients and families that help to
guide us and tell us what they need to get through the treatment,
and we meet on a monthly basis and work on various projects, so
that's one thing that has really been a huge improvement, I
believe, to care because we are hearing it directly from the people
who count. The other thing is with the internet, I think that
many people have access to many more resources and they come in
much more prepared and they ask us questions and we try to help
them manage whatever the need may be.
Wilson
You mentioned the boutique, obviously, that's a fantastic resource
that we have right here at Smilow Cancer Hospital.
Indeck
It's phenomenal.
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Wilson
What did patients do before we had Smilow, before we had a
boutique, what were their options at that point? It seems
obvious that we have got the boutique, but tell us the differences
and what that provides for patients to make things a lot easier for
them now, compared to say two years ago before we had it.
Indeck
The boutique allows patients and families to have one stop
shopping. They may be getting treatment, and may have to see
a physician for instance, or may be having surgery, breast surgery
and they do not know what they will need, they stop in the boutique
and either Linda Secher who is the manager, or Lynore Aaron who is
a certified fitter, help people with purchasing items that they are
going to need for their surgery. It allows people to come
down, and in the privacy of a small space try on wigs or try on
certain lingerie that have pockets for drains for instance.
It allows them to buy skin care products that have SPF in
them. It allows them to buy a bathrobe if they forget that
and that is something they want. It has inspirational books
and items that just make you feel better. What we try to do
is make you feel better emotionally, whether it be taking care of a
concrete need, or whether it is actually to buy something that
helps emotionally and to be able to do that where you are getting
treated instead of having to go out into the community and find the
correct resource is really a wonderful asset.
Wilson
Is there information about the boutique on our website if someone
who is not on campus here at Smilow wants to ask questions about
the boutique? Are they able to find their way to that online,
perhaps through the website or phone numbers available.
Indeck
They are able to just go onto Yale Cancer Center or Smilow Cancer
Hospital website and they will find the boutique there and there is
a search box, they can put it in, if it does not readily come up,
they can certainly call the main number and we will give them
whatever information they need. Generally speaking, however,
the boutique is located on the first floor of Smilow and it is
typically open from 9 to 5 and we can see patients in the evening,
or occasionally on the weekend if that is what is needed as
well.
Wilson
Just a general question, is this something that's available to all
patients in the community or does one have to be a patient under
active treatment here at Smilow? What are the guidelines, if
any exist?
Indeck
That's a great question. We want to be available to anybody
who needs us, so certainly if you are a patient, you are welcome to
come, but if you live in the community and even if you are getting
treated elsewhere, we would love for you to come in and we would be
happy to help you with whatever it is you may need.
Wilson
That's fantastic. Bonnie, tell us how you got interested in
this field in the first place? Tell us a little bit about
your background.
Indeck
I have been an oncology social worker at Yale-New Haven Hospital
for many years and over that
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time I have done both inpatient and outpatient work and I think
with many people your desire to work in cancer emanates from an
internal force, and the same was true for me, family members who
have had cancer. I have been doing this for so long now it
actually seems like it is just integral to who I am and the more
you do it, the more you know, that it is a wonderful place to be,
to be able to help patients and families and give them what they
need and just listen to their story, you benefit personally.
We do not often think of it like that, but the fact that somebody
will talk to you and tell you what is bothering them and what is
not bothering them and what is working well and being so proud to
share their stories, it makes my day, it makes my work so
wonderful.
Wilson
Tell us in more detail about the actual support services that are
available and how they are integrated into a patients' care through
their treatment course and their recovery.
Indeck
I am going to speak mainly about social work and we often see
patients based on referral by any member of the medical team
whether it be the physician, or the nurse, or by any staff, or a
patient and family can refer themselves. We just need to know
that it is something that is needed and we'll be happy to assess
and see what the needs are, so we are involved in inpatient and
outpatient, we do counseling, we actually have a brand new program
called PACT and it stands for Parenting at a Challenging Time, and
this program was developed from a hospital in Boston because we
know that parents who undergo treatment for cancer are always
concerned about their children and how are their children handling
it and are they telling their children the correct things and are
they guiding their children correctly, so along with the child
psychiatrist, the social workers see these parents because we do
believe that the parents know their children the best, and we hope
to guide them. They ask us questions, for instance, should I
be using the word cancer and we review with them what is generally
accepted from the literature and what we feel based on that is the
best way to manage children and help them to cope well. In
addition to that, we also have support groups. At any given
time, we have about a dozen different groups going on we have
groups that are for specific diagnoses like brain tumors, breast
cancer, GI cancers, head and neck, lung, melanoma, myeloma,
prostate cancer, and stem cell transplant, in addition to a group
for caregivers as well as a general cancer support group, and the
group for caregivers speaks directly to me because I believe that
caregivers undergo their own sort of stress. They often are
trying to balance many different roles at the same time and that
can be quite difficult and they need a little added support.
Wilson
What sort of things do you help the caregivers with and how are
they integrated into the program, give us some examples?
Indeck
In the caregiver support group, or even if we are meeting with
them one on one, we will talk about what it is that is stressful
for them. Our main advice to caregivers is to take care of
yourself, because often times caregivers feel that their whole life
has to be around the person with cancer. They may feel that
they are not allowed to take anytime for themselves to do anything
fun, they can't meet a girlfriend for lunch, or they can't go to a
movie, or get their hair done, and while things like that may be
true at certain times during an illness, if somebody is going
through an acute phase, but generally speaking, we suggest that
people take that time for themselves because
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it helps to renew them and to renew their spirit and it gives them
the strength that they need to get through everyday
Wilson
I see, and what sort of issues do you hear from patients with
regard to these support groups? What sort of feedback do you
get, I mean we have got such incredibly specialized medical care at
Smilow and at Yale, it sounds like with all the support groups you
just identified this aspect of care is equally specialized and
there is something available for all sorts of patients regardless
of their problem. What sort of feedback do you get from patients in
the program and support groups and that sort of thing?
Indeck
Generally speaking, we get very positive feedback because people
with cancer sometimes just want a place to talk with other people
who are undergoing the same kinds of things, have the same issues,
the same feelings and emotions, and while it may be specialized as
far as diagnosis goes, in general it allows them to share, and
learn how to cope, and that is really wonderful because patients
are able to give other patients things that professionals cannot.
I may think I understand what a patient is going through, but
until I am in that position, I really do not. And so our
feedback is very-very positive, in fact we are working on a
program, a new program right now, called patient-to-patient where
we are hoping to set up patients one on one with another, so if
somebody has been diagnosed, for instance, with breast cancer, we
are hoping to set them up with the newly diagnosed patients so that
they will have an opportunity to get their questions answered.
Wilson
In general, what is the size of the support group on average, do
they meet in the evenings, and how frequently?
Indeck
Each group is a little bit different and the group themselves
typically decide what they need. So we have some groups that
meet every other week, we have groups that meet monthly, it really
does depend, we meet during the daytime, we meet in the evening
time, sometimes we have refreshments, more often we do not and
people bring food with them and that's all fine so they tell us
what they need and that's what we try to do and they come up with
great ideas. I can tell you that we had a flyer for our
prostate cancer support group and guys in the group decided that
they needed to have the information on a small business card size
paper, because they often stick it in their jacket pocket and they
could not hand it out to other men if it was a large flyer, but to
tell you honestly, I would have never thought of that, so it was a
real improvement.
Wilson
Terrific. We are going to take a short break for a medical
minute. Please stay tuned to learn more information about
support services with Bonnie Indeck.
Wilson
Welcome back to Yale Cancer Center Answers. This is Dr. Lynn
Wilson and I am joined by my guest Bonnie Indeck and we are
discussing support services for cancer patients. Bonnie, we
were talking about support groups and you were giving us some other
details about when they meet and examples of some successes.
How does a patient access a support group? If one of my
patients, for example, has lung cancer and has heard about the
support group or I have told them about it, where do we go from
there to actually get them involved?
Indeck
What we like you to do is to have your patient call the Department
of Social Work and we are happy to guide you to the appropriate
support group. Many patients are told about the groups by
their social workers anyhow. We have flyers that we give to
patients and we also post them and we hope that people will take
advantage of the groups. They are really quite helpful and
sometimes people will say to me, I am a little scared to go to a
group, I do not like talking in a large crowd, but to be honest
about it, we always say to folks, you do not have to talk in the
beginning, just come and listen and see what happens and before you
know it everybody is really talking because it is peer to
peer. We are there, the social workers are there, and many
times nurses co-facilitate with us, but we are there as
facilitators. We are not there to take over the group, we are
there to help you to talk, to categorize and label what we are
hearing and to make sure that people in the group are really
hearing what other folks are saying, perhaps learning how to cope
based on ideas that have developed in the group and things of that
nature. So it is really a wonderful way to meet with other
people in a little bit of a more formal setting.
Wilson
Obviously a cancer diagnosis and treatment is a deeply personal
experience and very different for every patient. In your experience
Bonnie, do you find that most patients are familiar with the
support group concept, but are a little afraid to get involved, or
is it something that most people want to do or feel they need to be
pushed because they may not be interested? What have you done to
try to get them involved if they are afraid?
Indeck
We always tell people directly what's involved. So we lay
the ground rules, so to speak, to begin with, and we encourage
people to try it at least once or twice. Many people do want
to come but what I find as a reason that they can't come often is
because of the care the patient is getting. The timing may not be
great for everybody and that is part of the reason that we have
various times for groups, so that if you can't make an evening
group, perhaps you can make a daytime group, but it is more because
of concrete reasons that folks do not always come then any other
reason, but at Smilow Cancer Hospital we continue to run a Look
Good, Feel Better program which is a program
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that we co-sponsor with the American Cancer Society. The objective
of the program is to help women cope and deal, and learn how to
manage skin and hair changes during cancer treatment. We have
complimentary makeup that woman get and we show them tricks about
how to put it on, how to make eyebrows when you have lost your
eyebrows. We give out scarves, we have wigs available for
women, and this is a group that we ran on a monthly basis for many
years, but what we found is that our waiting list for the group was
so long that we have now recently increased the group to twice a
month and we are filled each time. Women walk away saying thank you
so much because it is so gratifying to them to learn that they are
not alone, and they know that intellectually, but it is very
different when you are sitting around the table and women pull off
wigs and take off the makeup they have on, they learn how to put on
new eyebrows, how to put on blush or something of that nature, and
actually many women share phone numbers and talk afterward because
they bonded so much in a program like that.
Wilson
I was going to ask you, after patients are finished with their
actual treatment experience and they are in the recovery phase and
months to years go on, have you witnessed patients forming strong
bonds during the actual treatment process and that these folks stay
in touch with each other long term?
Indeck
I think that is true many times. It all depends what else is
going on in people's lives, obviously. We do have a
Survivorship Clinic at Smilow Cancer Hospital and we run groups
through that clinic as well, so it is also a way to connect with
other people who are in that phase of their illness.
Wilson
Tell us a little bit more about the Complimentary Therapy
Program.
Indeck
We do have complimentary therapies and we are one of the only
cancer centers that provide it free of charge. We provide massage,
Reiki, guided imagery, yoga, and art expressions. This is also one
of our programs that has a waiting list because it helps people to
revitalize, it helps people to get a half hour or an hour to
themselves to renew their spirit and to continue to go on. So
men and women love this program.
Wilson
For this program, does someone have to be under care
currently?
Indeck
Yes, generally speaking it is for people who are in active
treatment.
Wilson
And this is at Smilow as well?
Indeck
It is.
Wilson
Okay.
Indeck
We have a room for it on the first floor of Smilow, where
appointments are made and we can send people up for that. We
also have a therapist that goes to the inpatient and outpatient
unit to
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provide some of the care in a decentralized fashion and all of our
therapist are either certified or licensed depending on what it is
and what their requirements are.
Wilson
Terrific, there is a program that is under development and almost
ready to open up called the Resource Room. Can you tell us
about that?
Indeck
The Resource Room is still, as you are mentioning, under
development. We have a spot that will have computers
available, there will be somebody manning the room and we want it
to be a 'soft place the fall'. While we want to help you
educationally, books, pamphlets, whatever it is you may need, we
are thinking that we also want to help you take care of
yourself. So come in, stop and have a cup of coffee or tea,
and we are trying to figure out with patients and families right
now if they would even like it to be more diversionary than that.
So whether they want to have a knitting class, for instance, or
come speak to the social worker on a certain day or come speak with
a Chaplin, or come with questions about bills. We hope to do
many different kinds of things, but again it is the patients and
families who will be telling us exactly what they want to see in
the resource room.
Wilson
When will it be available and where it will be located?
Indeck
Again, in Smilow, on the first floor. That first floor is
very big, we have a lot of programing that goes on there and we are
hoping that it will be open in the spring time.
Wilson
That is terrific. Bonnie, tell us some other things that you
have seen people gain from their cancer experience, relationships
with family members, new perspectives on life, as we said in the
beginning. You have been at this a long time and have a tremendous
amount of experience. Share some other stories with us.
Indeck
You are absolutely right. It gives people the ability to
have a different perspective of life, and I remember I had one
gentleman who had a lymphoma and he was really struggling with it
initially. This was several years back, and he just did not
realize the best way to cope for him and he finally came to the
conclusion that even though the treatment was difficult for him,
without treatment he was not going to be here at all, and I
remember during a particular support group session he said to
another new patient, while it is not easy to go through treatment,
if you do not have it there are no options available to you, even
though you may struggle here and there with some of the symptoms
and side effects of treatment, it is far better than not having it
and he was then able to turn to his life around in a way that was
pretty amazing to watch. He was able to take a lot of things
in stride that otherwise he would not have been able to and his
family mentioned to me the change in him. So I knew that it
was a long lasting kind of change and something that other people
were noticing as well.
Wilson
That is interesting. We have talked a fair amount about
groups, and the programs that are available, but I want to point
out and have you expand a little bit on some of the other very
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individualized services that you are offering all the time for
patients, dealing with financial issues, housing for patients who
may come from a far distance, and transportation. I had two
patients this morning that I saw who had transportation issues and
we needed to get our social worker involved immediately to help
these folks. Tell us about some of those things. How
does that work?
Indeck
Patients and families will tell us what they need and in fact,
very recently, we have new lodging that opened up and it is called
The Suites at Yale-New Haven and it is just a couple of blocks from
the hospital. There are 24 private suites that are three
rooms, they are fully furnished, so up to, I believe four or six
people, can be in any given room. There is a kitchenette so
you can make your own food if you shop, and it really is an
asset. We find that they have been filled already even though
they have recently opened.
Wilson
Oh that is right.
Indeck
People come in and they go out, so we always suggest that you
call, again it is called Suites at Yale-New Haven and it is on the
internet and people can absolutely access it and make a reservation
like a hotel, and it has been a great asset for us because people
have felt calmer knowing that they are close to us. In fact,
I had a patient a couple of weeks ago when we had that big snow
storm and she called The Suites and got a room and was able to be
at our facility at 8 o'clock the next morning and she said to us, I
did not want to have to worry about driving. Now that was
quite wonderful that she had the ability to do that and previously
she could have stayed in New Haven, but it would not have been as
convenient. Our security will drive you back and forth, if
that is what you need, the parking is free there. It really
is a great resource to have.
Wilson
That is excellent, and do you help patients with transportation
needs, interpretation of medical bills, and help with insurance and
things like that?
Indeck
Yes and no. We will be happy to help people with insurance
and figure out what their questions may be. We do have a
department call PFAS which is Patient Financial and Admitting
Services and we work with them. They are the experts in
insurance and finance as far as what is covered, what benefits you
may have and things of that nature. We are more the expert in
helping you get other resources if you should need those. The
one nice thing about Smilow is that you can really see teams
working together. You no longer ever hear, that is not my
job, I do not do that, but rather, let's work on it together and
even with transportation, for instance, we will absolutely help
patients find transportation by using our community
resources. The American Cancer Society does have a Road to
Recovery Program and we use them quite frequently to help our
patients come to the hospital.
Bonnie Indeck is Director of Patient and Family Services at Yale Cancer Center. If you have questions or would like to share your comments, visit yalecancercenter.org, where you can also subscribe to our podcast and find written transcripts of past programs. I am Bruce Barber and you are listening to the WNPR Health Forum on the Connecticut Public Broadcasting Network.